Good one, Patty! :)

Dean: Do you truly understand the economics that put Greece into the crisis it now finds itself? Do you understand there is little to no correlation between the dynamics underpinning their situation and that of the US?

Please do not parrot platitudes heard on propaganda radio shows. Do your homework. Know your subject.

Eliana,

Do you not understand that the basic problem in Greece is that the spending -especially on social programs--was totally out of control? That is also the problem here. Look at the states and cities that are in deep trouble in the United States. The greatest problem is the pension cost. Too much money being paid for too little work in the past. The same is true in Greece.
When you pay out more than you take in, you are in trouble. Raising taxes will not solve the problem--at best it would pay for a few days. We already owe China far too much: 40 cents on every dollar is going to pay China.
You don't see this as a problem?

Eliana, you'd do well to learn from Kathy.

Kathy, The right-wing zealots have been shouting "doom" ever since Obama took office. Nothing they predicted ever happened. Interest rates were supposed to soar, instead they are way less than the inflation rate. Everyone wants to lend money to the USA. The worst thing that has happened is the downgrading of the US credit rating -- and that was triggered by the irresponsible actions of the right-wing zealots. You really come across like a doomsday cult follower, constantly revising the date on which the world will end. Time to admit that you got it wrong.

Actually our hardship is caused by greed -- unemployment could be ended in 24 hours if excessively paid CEO's (not small business owners) but the corporate giants like at Discovery Communications chief executive David M. Zaslav’s pay were used instead to create jobs or to free up costs so American's could pay their bills.

The head of the Silver Spring cable programming giant scored a 23 percent raise to $52.4 million in total compensation in 2011, making him the highest paid executive at a public company in the Washington area for the second year in a row. His raise, generous as it was, was still far more modest than the 264 percent boost he recorded in 2010. (See http://www.washingtonpost.com/ceo-pay-continues-to-climb-in-washington-area/2012/06/22/gJQA7XqC0V_story.html)

The Republican's blame the unions for our woes (only 6 % of the work force is part of a union); so if the union's are destroying America what is corporate America doing when they outsourced 25% of our jobs (10 million mfg. jobs and 6 million service / high tech jobs) not only did they add to our costs; but also cut back tax revenues. Economists have been predicting since the 1980's that every state in the Union could go broke if we DO NOT change our health care system. Nothing's been done by either party. All the budgets are out of control: Defense ($893 billion) and Welfare ($451.9 billion) health care ($846.11 billion) and pensions ($819.7). Notice welfare is the smallest number.

How's that? Going to war with Iran will be the end of the US, financially. We're already at $16 trillion in debt and rising. And it looks like Romney wants to pick a fight with Putin. If we could send his 5 boys over and put them on the front lines when he starts the next. That tough talk could be to appease the neo-cons but could also get us in WWIII. AND, let's not forget those SOCIAL programs that are bankrupting the US. US dollars spent on US people. Mirabile Dictu! LET'S forget about the unprovoked invasion and illegal occupation of Iraq (ONLY $1 trillion) and the $50 billion we give away annually in Foreign Aid--including propping up Pakistan's military. (Are we nuts? That's what the US Media said about Ron Paul when he wanted to cut ALL of them off). And our ripped roads, wrecked highways, crumbling bridges while we build brand new ones in Afghanistan. Yep! It's those dagnabbit SOCIAL programs alright. Everyone who pays into Social Security doesn't deserve................

@Eliana -

Greece dynamics is extremely similar to that in the U.S. I know my subject, you clearly do not.

What's amusing is that this post directly proceeds a "con", not a "lib", offering a "hateful" comment.

It's real apparent to me you were not smart enough to post. Better go back to just reading.

@Scott - google Don Joy and patch.com together. You'll find that this guy spends about 16 hours a day, 7 days a week trolling this site. This is his whole life. Kind of blows your supposition doesn't it?

Obama did the exact same thing introducing Biden as his VP pick in 2008.

"remains unknowable. He seems to have no personality. He projects an attractive and comfortable appearance but it's hard to detect anything happening inside." Funny... that's how I feel about our current President.

Romney is a suit's suit with a fancy horse and a dumb wife...but he did put the flip-flop on the political map.

I agree with your politics but disagree with the notion that Ryan isn't an election asset to Romney. I think it was a smart move on his part. What Romney needs is for his base to keep up the "Obama is a socialist, Obama is awful, we hate him" feelings enough to show up at the polls in droves on election day. Ryan is great at drumming up those feelings among the Republican and Tea Party faithful. He's charismatic and smart in ways that Romney isn't. I worry that the Dems are going to underestimate his power and not show up to the polls.

Your ignorance is amazing. You have not read the Ryan plan and you ignore that Medicare will get raped of $billions to pay for Obamacare. GetReal, indeed.

CBPP Comment on CBO report on Ryan's budget proposal:

The CBO report . . .shows that Ryan’s budget path would shrink federal expenditures for everything other than Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, the Children’s Health Insurance Program (CHIP), and interest payments to just 3¾ percent of the gross domestic product (GDP) by 2050. Since, as CBO notes, “spending for defense alone has not been lower than 3 percent of GDP in any year [since World War II]” and Ryan seeks a high level of defense spending, . . . the rest of government would largely have to disappear. That includes everything from veterans’ programs to medical and scientific research, highways, education, nearly all programs for low-income families and individuals other than Medicaid, national parks, border patrols, protection of food safety and the water supply, law enforcement, and the like.

In addition, CBO shows that total federal spending — including Social Security, interest, and health care — would fall to 16 percent of GDP by 2050 under Ryan’s budget path . . . This would be the lowest level since 1950, when Medicare, Medicaid, most federal funding for education, highways, and environmental protection, and various other significant federal activities did not exist.

The Ryan budget would start down this path immediately, with severe cuts in non-defense discretionary programs over the next ten years. . . .

(Edited to meet space limits only.)

hmmm....do you think he will bring his transvaginal ultrasound probe with him?

Romney brings stellar executive ability and acumen regarding the economic factors most pressing today, along with the ability to form a complete sentence in English and at least a sufficient vocabulary...but most important of all, Romney brings PAUL RYAN's budget sagacity and disciplined, laser-focus on sheer fiscal problem-solving.

Amazing! Is this the best in a political discussion that you Libs can come up with? Don't you have any substantive comments?

When you have no argument, resort to name-calling. Gee, you must be a liberal.

duh.....you reference the "Democratically controlled Senate"....but the Repubs won't let a simple majority work these days....they use the filibuster rule, so nothing can even come up for a vote unless the Dems have 61...so your premise is false.

@oldtowner -

The Filibuster rule has been in effect for longer than you and I have been alive. Democrats used the Filibuster under Bush. Where was your outrage then (smell the hypocrisy...)?

@Lee Hernly...we all know the filibuster has been around for a long time...everyone has used it, but the current Repubs have been abusing it....check out this excerpt from a book I suggest you read, "It's Even Worse Than it Looks."
In their new book, "It's Even Worse Than It Looks," Thomas Mann and Norman Ornstein -- two of the most prominent talking heads in Washington, known for their balanced view and proclivity toward moderation -- say that the Republican Party is to blame.
"The GOP," they wrote in a Washington Post op-ed based on the book, "has become an insurgent outlier in American politics." Mann and Ornstein trace the partisan style back to the emergence of Newt Gingrich and Grover Norquist in the 1970s, when the two men promoted a style of slash-and-burn, take-no-prisoners politics that has remained integral to the strategy of congressional Republicans." Also, it used to take 66 (2/3 of the Senate) to end a filibuster....now it only takes 60. Regardless, the Repubs in the Senate have used this tactic to prevent a reasonable discussion about anything.

I thought the idea was to state if you thought it was a good pick for vice prez
But I could be wrong????

Hilary wants to distance herself from the DNC as she's running in 2016.

Romney knows that if you lower taxes and get less revenue, you cut spending and spend less. Bush didn't get that. Bush cut taxes across the board then increased spending dramatically. If you cut taxes the right way as Clinton and the D's did in 1996, that increases revenue, not decreases it. That's the biggest difference between the two. GWB was irresponsible financially with the country. The other has given no indication whatsoever that he would follow suit, quite the opposite. A good example of Romney in action is at the Winter Olympics. When he came on board they were tens of billions of dollars in debt and turned the games around so that in the end, the games ended up with a surplus.

We have every reason to believe that Romney, unlike Bush or Obama, will do something about debts and deficits. He even outlined a very detailed plan about it.

Lee, the Bush tax cuts did result in more revenue--record amounts. Bush knew of the Laffer Curve and put it to use well, as did the Gingrich congress in the 90s. As to the spending, Bush did spend like a drunken democrat, unfortunately.

@LeeHernly....ah, Lee, here's an excerpt from an abc news article about Romney and the Winter Olympics....
"As for his experience running the 2002 Salt Lake City Olympics, Romney says, “”the whole winter games was a combination of the federal, state and local governments along with private enterprise.”
“We actually received over $410 million from the federal government for the Olympic games. That is a huge increase over anything ever done before and we did that by going after every agency of government,” he says.
He even cites money one his colleagues managed to get for the Olympics from the Department of Education."
Seems he was fine with using federal dollars for that. Or did he build it himself? :)

Yes THINK!

Condoleezza Rice the other night reminds us all that “...when a nation loses control of its finances, it eventually loses control of its destiny “. This is no different than each of us knows about running our personal finances.

Obama and his crack WH admin team have given the American people, and especially those that follow us a $16 trillion debt, growing to at least $20 trillion if they get another four years. The nation urgently needs a change in WH attitude and thinking toward jobs and economic growth, and reduced spending at least until the rush toward emulating Greece is abated.

Romney’s business and management experience is exactly what we need at this time in a chief executive. Those that condemn his for his work at Bain should look at their investment portfolio before they cast stones.. they may well be casting stones at a company that they and millions of other Americans own a part of [url=http://www.nypost.com/p/news/opinion/opedcolumnists/look_who_parks_their_cash_at_bain_88KSQrw8BXciEidja2ZQXN] (Link)[/url].

Stix--I strongly disagree that we should elect a president who specialized in, and made his wealth by, leveraged buyouts; investing a small amount of capital, borrowing the rest, weighing down the targeted company with large amounts of debt, extracting the maximum amount of profit for the investors and often leaving the company to file for bankruptcy. This is not the political leadership that we need. Have a read of the below quote:

""Marc Wolpow, a former Bain colleague of Romney's, told reporters during Mitt's first Senate run that Romney erred in trying to sell his business as good for everyone. "I believed he was making a mistake by framing himself as a job creator," said Wolpow. "That was not his or Bain's or the industry's primary objective. The objective of the LBO business is maximizing returns for investors." When it comes to private equity, American workers – not to mention their families and communities – simply don't enter into the equation.""

Read more: http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/greed-and-debt-the-true-story-of-mitt-romney-and-bain-capital-20120829#ixzz25JIqc4hD

Rolling Stone magazine, that journalistic boutique where half-truth(such as the bombastic article linked) passes as artistic license and "reporting."

Cathryn, no business exists(for long) with "job creation" as its primary goal. Wise up.

Cathryn, putting "job creation" before maximizing returns for investors is putting the cart before the horse. Jobs are only perpetuated in cases where market forces(specifically, innovation, consumer demand, and cost-control discipline) are first satisified, and where investors have confidence in a business unit's viability, evidenced by sufficient/ample ROI. This is one of the key areas where Marxists like Obama and most of the democrat party are clueless.

The truth about Romney and Bain Capital is not to be found in the pages of Rolling Stone.

http://spectator.org/blog/2012/08/31/defending-bain-finally

Wall Street Journal, Jan. 9: The Wall Street Journal, aiming for a comprehensive assessment, examined 77 businesses Bain invested in while Mr. Romney led the firm from its 1984 start until early 1999, to see how they fared during Bain’s involvement and shortly afterward.

Among the findings: 22% either filed for bankruptcy reorganization or closed their doors by the end of the eighth year after Bain first invested, sometimes with substantial job losses. An additional 8% ran into so much trouble that all of the money Bain invested was lost.

Rice was the one who carried on about how the aluminium tubes could ONLY be used for nuclear enrichment - surely she knew better than that - until it was undeniable that they were more suited to conventional missiles than nuclear enrichment. When confronted about the false information she had been spewing, she was quoted as saying "Well, that's what they told me." Ah yes, PhD-level sophistication, that.

I don't recall Rice ever expanding on how she had been so ridiculously misinformed. Seems to me that it would be her duty to expose the source of the false information, and any other information that could expose the conspiracy behind the lies that were routinely handed to the American People back then. But she apparently didn't see things that way.

It disgusts me that people are more concerned with political affiliation than with fact, especially when obviously deliberate non-fact got so many people killed, did less than nothing for our security (Iraq is aligning with Iran now, isn't that wonderful), and just about crashed our economy.

Bob, I usually respect your opinion, but here you and others are making at least three mistakes: First, you assume that no evidence of Hussein stockpiling WMD components in Iraq existed; it did turn out that vast stockpiles were found and were detected being moved into Syria, but the media squashed the stories as they emerged over the many months following the initial invasion. Second, you assume that key evidence on which the reasons for invasion was partially based was deliberately fabricated--it wasn't. Third, you assume that WMD threats were the only reason for invading Iraq--they were actually only one facet of an array of factors which compelled us to act in the Middle East following the attacks of 9/11 and decades of troublemaking from bad actors in that region. Cont.'

I do believe that our efforts in the Middle East have been horribly mismanaged in terms of our reluctance to be engage in even 1/4th the amount of sheer ruthlessness necessary to change the dynamics there, and instead we have bogged down seemingly forever in vain, naive, and costly marathon exercises in futile altruistic delusions that Muslims can somehow be persuaded to join the human race, our folly so egregious to point where we even helped the savages in both Iraq and Afghanistan write Islam into their new constitutions as the supreme law of the land! How stupid can we be...convincing ourselves that we are spreading freedom while we help perpetuate Islamic totalitarianism and dump billions into our enemies' laps to help them grow stronger...

Now watch, this is the part where a Patch editor usually wades in and admonishes us to "stay on topic" only because a republican is getting the upper hand in the debate...

Don, are you really saying that the news media had a Rice look-alike make fake press conferences and make repeated bogus claims about how aluminum tubes could only be used for nuclear enrichment? Please.

It is indisputable that Rice actually made those bogus claims that the aluminum tubes could only be used for nuclear enrichment, and it is indisputable that those were in fact totally bogus claims. Those aluminum tubes were more suited to conventional missile production than nuclear enrichment, and Rice had been making a total fool of herelf claiming that they could ONLY be used for nuclear enrichment.

After such an obvious demonstration of incompetence and total lack of integrity, I'm amazed that Rice was trotted out once again by the Republican Party - but I guess they are accustomed to the idea that the American People have no clue. Unfortunately, the Democratic party is no better in that regard. And both parties have convinced me that their opposing parties are no good. There is little left but mud to sling, I fear.

Quite honestly my recollection is that single-item intelligence controversies, of which there were more than just the aluminum tube dispute, did not decide whether we invaded Iraq or not: The case was made based on a myriad of compelling factors which were ALL brought to bear in the dire aftermath of the worst attack on American soil, and America, by a foreign force in all of recorded history. We resolved, as a nation, and with the bi-partisan vote of congress and umpteen UN declarations, that we would NO LONGER have a prolonged standoff with a genocidal Islamic tyrant in the Middle East who continually violated the cease fire agreement from the first Gulf war, who continually fired on our planes patrolling the no-fly zone, who continually sponsored terror attacks throughout the world(especially paying thousands and thousands of dollars to families of suicide bombers which targeted innocent families of our ally Israel), and on and on. Need I bury your argument further in the dirt?

Don, it's not a question of whether Rice's bogus claims about the aluminum tubes did or didn't tip the scale and rush us to war. The point is that Rice made bogus claims that she should have questioned, and she did not expose the source of the bad information when it was proven to be wrong, wrong, wrong. And now here she is, pushing some political agenda - probably with just as little knowledge, understanding or integrity as she had in those days.

Bob, Colin Powell acknowledged at the time--when he went before the UN--that there was an ongoing dispute about the nature of the tubes, but Monday morning quarterbacking of this single item intelligence factor in the context of the many compelling factors which decided the matter is kind of myopic and moot, really. It is also quite a stretch to say that Rice or anyone in the Bush administration deliberately deceived at all on the issue.

To the point, I do not accept your assertion that Rice's integrity is at all in question based on the careful measures she and others took to protect our country following the attacks of 9/11. Perhaps you'd have less to say if Saddam wound up succeeding after his earlier, thwarted attempt to assassinate our country's president.

Rice passed along lies, and she should be held accountable for it. The Republican Party is scraping the bottom of the barrel if she is the one they trot out to speak. I only wish that the Democratic Party was really any better.

That's funny, Bob, even the racially-obsessed, anti-republican commies over at MSNBC couldn't contain their enthusiasm for Condi Rice's speech, nor did they try to conceal it. They all agreed that she made a phenomenally compelling speech, before they set about trying to nitpick it here and there for their partisan purposes.

...and you're just a bit rabid in your condemnation of her efforts in her role as national security advisor back then, I think.

No, because thinking like mine has not been applied whatsoever.

All, please note that a few comments above, Don Joy claims that Muslims are not part of the human race.....enough said. I think no one should offer him the courtesy of a reply. And Patch should delete his vile, hate-filled comments.

Yes, my assertion is that the "Muslim world" chooses not to join the rest of the human race in advancing beyond the atavistic savagery that prevails throughout their largely backward, primitive, theocratic, tribal empires of darkness and spiritual oppression. Meanwhile, the democrats are hosting a Muslim-fest at the DNC convention in Charlotte, with hours and hours of jihadists amassing for mass prayers, led by none other than some of the chief cheerleaders and global sponsors of terrorist groups around. Don't believe me? You want links? The democrats accuse the GOP of some absurd "war on women" for objecting to the idea that private individuals and religious organizations should be forced to subsidize and supply the likes of Sandra Fluke with contraceptives and abortion services upon demand, as if it is her "right" to force her lifestyle/deathstyle choices on us all and our checkbooks, while Muslims treat women around the globe like chattel...amazing, the hypocrisy of a party that accuses the CEO of a fast-food chain of "hate" for answering a journalists question as to his beliefs on gay marriage, while they invite the leaders and denizens of a culture that regularly executes gays into their midst to "celebrate diversity."

The DNC even has the actual serial rapist Bill Clinton as a keynote speaker, while they try to smear the GOP as waging a "war on women" for drawing a line at Catholics and private individuals & organizations being forced to underwrite and cough up funds to pay for Sandra Fluke's various debaucheries and infanticide...unreal...

Then explain the umpteen UN resolutions to use force to remove Saddam Hussein, many of which preceded the bi-partisan vote of the United States Congress, and to which Bush finally gave teeth. Explain the repeated calls for the forceful removal of Saddam Hussein made by Al Gore, Bill Clinton, Hillary Clinton, and countless others on both sides of the aisle all throughout the 90s. Either the word resolution means resolution, or words have no meaning whatsoever.

That is, all of which preceded the invasion by the coalition of nations.

...most of which even preceded the attacks of 9/11.

Iraq had zippo, zorch, nada to do with the 9/11 attack. DJ, you're scraping the bottom of the Bush administration barrel to revive that old nonsense.

Since you say that the USA was right to attack Iraq because of UN resolutions, where do you stand on UN resolutions against Israel? Seems to me that you have a philosophical conflict here. Let me know if you ever resolve your philosophical conflict.

Barbara Glakas is correct. Rice and Powell and Tenet should have resigned on principle.

And the Iraq war debate continues even to this day, ho hum!

The facts are 1. Saddam once had WMD, 2. he defied the UN in its attempt to verify their destruction, 3. Democrats and Republicans alike at the time thought he still had them, and 4. Democrats and Republicans alike voted for war. And one more fact, once we determined there were no WMDs (of significant amount) the left-wingers mounted and still maintain today a partisan anti-Bush anti-Republican rant. Revisionist history making and fact avoidance abounds!

Tis’ a shame because the real problem TODAY is a largely failed Obama foreign policy, with Hillary Clinton the latest rendition of Condoleezza Rice. Yes Obama should be given credit for ordering the bin Laden kill.. but does anyone believe a Republican president would not have done the same?

As to the rest of the Obama foreign policy, Are we better off anywhere overseas? Go through each Mideast and European country especially including Iran and Afghanistan ard grade our status. My grade, C minus which would be a D if not for the bin Laden kill.

@Bob Bruhns

Actually, if you read the Wikileaks dump on Iraq, they were heavily involved w/ training Al Qaeda inside the country pre-9/11. You'd be astounded at what you read and yes, that includes WMDs inside the country. Gee, I wonder why the leftist media ignored this?

As for UN sanctions against Israel, let's just say no one should be taking their cue from an organization that has/had Libya, Iran & China on its Human Rights Council. Seriously?

Obama didn't give the order to nail Bin Laden anyway--it was Leon Panetta who overrode Obama's and Valerie Jarrett's stalling tactics and told the SEAL commanders to go. Obama was dragged in off the golf course after the fact and told by his betters to sit down, shut up, and enjoy the fact that he would be able to take public credit for Panetta's resoluteness.

Bob, my position is that UN resolutions are mostly worthless, given that it was only Bush and Blair finally acting and assembling a coalition of nations to remove Hussein after the UN refused to put teeth behind their words for many years. But if you think they mean anything, then you have to accept that Bush and Rice and Powell and the rest did the exactly right thing. As far as UN resolutions against Israel, why should I give any weight whatsoever to a completely different type of resolutions against our ally, which is surrounded by enemies? What does it say about the credibility of an organization which hosts the likes of North Korea, Iran, Syria, Libya, and so forth on their Human Rights Council?? Geez!

Oh here we go, the old neo-con lies all over again.

Anyway, Rice pushed the Cheney policy, and pretended that the aluminum tubes could only be used for nuclear enrichment - which was not only false, but those tubes really were not even suited for nuclear enrichment (tens of thousands of them, manufactured with walls that were way too thick, etc) - and then she went on to raise the spectre of a mushroom cloud in order to frighten Americans into compliance with their measures.

And the neo-con filled Bush administration was certainly not being safe or careful - they might have prepared for a liquid explosive attack if they had. Certainly they knew that such an attack was attempted in the 90s, but they did absolutely NOTHING to protect us against another. So it is not surprising that exactly such an attack was almost carried out in 2006 - five years after 9/11. Oh - and by the way, it was a Muslim in England who warned us about that plan. And only THEN did our supposedly protective neo-con leaders take action to prevent such an attack. Face it - they were not worried, they just wanted to make war.

@rick barasso....kudos to you; you know where DJ is coming from....

Of course you wouldn't.

You wouldn't know the difference between the Declaration of Independence and the Koran, or between the U.S. Constitution and the Hadith & Surahs.

@rick barasso -

Oh yes, the Tea Party is like Muslims - really? Has any one in the Tea Party stoned a woman? Unlike the leftist Occupy movement, has anyone in the Tea Party sexually assaulted or raped a woman? No.

It was Clinton who had multiple chances to kill Bin Laden, and neglected to do it--even after the embassy bombings in Africa and the USS Cole attack. Read Lt. Col. Buzz Patterson's book, "Dereliction of Duty." Patterson carried the "nuclear football" with the launch codes while he was a military attache to the Clinton White House. Patterson was constantly by Clinton's side, and describes in detail multiple occasions when special forces operators had Bin Laden in the crosshairs, with a very limited and rapidly closing window of opportunity, with the calls coming in for an executive decision from Clinton when he was reached on the golf course or otherwise playing grab-ass...and Clinton repeatedly just grumbled and blew off the decision, telling Patterson to tell the commanders that he'd "get back to them," and never did, choosing instead to play out his round of golf, etc., the opportunity missed again and again. Patterson is the one who actually took the emergency phone calls from the special ops commanders, and relayed the urgent messages to Clinton.

It was George W. Bush who blew off the CIA guy who ran out to the Texas ranch where Bush II was taking yet another vacation, to warn him about an impending attack, shortly before 9/11.
http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/0711/p13s01-bogn.html

And of course, (then) Secretary of State Rice had no recollection of pre-9/11 warnings about al-Qaeda. Well, except that there were a lot of them.
http://www.cbsnews.com/2100-250_162-2056915.html
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/10/02/washington/03ricecnd.html?_r=1

Speaking of bad intelligence information - on August 20, 1998, Clinton attacked what apparently turned out to be an aspirin factory, after the same neo-cons who later took over the Bush administration petitioned him on January 26, 1998 to act against Iraq and depose Saddam. Gee, look at the names of those signatories on that petition, including Richard L. Armitage - you know, the deputy Secretary of State who leaked Valerie Plame's name.
http://www.newamericancentury.org/iraqclintonletter.htm

Hmm, the blunder at the aspirin factory was Clintons fault, of course, according to the neo-cons. But Dick Cheney and Douglas Feith could manipulate all intelligence information, plant misinformation in the news media, and rush the nation to war - but that was of course just an intelligence failure... according to them.

Oh, what's the point, you'll never admit the truth.

"Some presidents care that the right targets are hit with as few innocent casualities as possible, and some just kill without any care at all for innocent victims"

Tell that to Obama that has expanded the use of drones some six times since January 2009. Some estimates are that over 700 innocent civilians have murdered.
As a result the Obama admin has been criticized by both members of Congress and outside human rights groups as well. In my view this indiscriminate drone use is both cowardly and hypocritical, especially for a Party that fervently claims to be the worlds beacon of human rights.

By now everyone should recognize that whenever and wherever the Tea Party holds a rally, even when they've had massive gatherings in D.C., we always leave the area spotless, picking up trash that was there when we arrived, and leaving the place cleaner than it was before the events! By contrast, the entire national Mall was completely trashed after the Obama inauguration, with garbage strewn everywhere, and of course the Occupy movement so adoringly fawned over and praised by Obama, Pelosi, and the rest is responsible for untold amounts of vandalism, sexual assaults, property crimes, thefts, stabbings, torching businesses and police cars, defecating everywhere and spreading all kinds of diseases...and let's not overlook the behavior of the Muslim Brotherhood(the group that originally spawned Al Qaeda) especially in Tafir Square where multiple Western female journalists have been attacked and gang-raped by swarming throngs of rabid Muslims...

LOL! A little in denial are we? Have you ever spent time in a OWS camp??

While yes, there have been arrests in all types of protests, the most law-abiding and yet most effective folks have been the Tea Party recently. I only brought up Occupy movement b/c you wrongly compared the Tea Party to the Taliban and have outed you as a liar. But, when Democrats in Alexandria continue to elect an alleged wife-beater like Jim Moran, we shouldn't be surprised.

Now as for the ultrasound bill, no one is 'dictating' anything. The bill was an update on Virginia’s informed-consent law, and didn’t require a particular kind of ultrasound (sorry, the word 'transvaginal' never appears in the bill), but mandated that the “standard medical practice in the community” for an ultrasound be followed. So doctors on site, not the governor or the house of delegates or any other GOPer, would be making the calls about exactly what kind of ultrasound would be best for a particular woman. Planned Parenthood and about 99% of other abortion clinics already do ultrasounds (it helps with the pricing of abortions, and so clinics know which procedure is best). The law wasn’t meant to do anything but make sure no women fell through the cracks. But, as we've come to find out, Democrats wouldn't know the truth if it smacked them square in the head.

Physically attacking women - Democrats know how to do that best.

@Lee Hernly: once again you are incorrect. McDonnell (and many of his conservative colleagues) did want to mandate a "vaginal" ultra sound....maybe "transvaginal" was not used in the language, but "vaginal" definitely was. Perhaps you have never been pregnant. Pregnant women often have EXTERNAL ultrasounds....that's where the instrument is moved around on the OUTSIDE of your abdomen and they can see the interior of the womb. However, McDonnell and his allies wanted an INTERNAL ultrasound....which requires inserting an instrument/probe INTO a woman's vagina. You make it sound like this legislation was trying to do women a big favor. Ha! Here is an excerpt from an article in the NYT, which I suggest you read. And here's hoping you never get pregnant.
"Gov. Bob McDonnell of Virginia backed down on Wednesday on a bill requiring women to have a vaginal ultrasound before undergoing an abortion. It was a sudden change of position for a conservative governor who is viewed as having political ambitions on the national stage."
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/23/us/governor-of-virginia-calls-for-changes-in-abortion-bill.html?_r=1&pagewanted=all

@getreal -

I think you mean the GM union and not the employees. How much do union bosses make again? The taxpayers got the short end of the stick in the GM deal and the union bosses benefited. Sure sounds like the President has his priorities straight doesn't it? After all, the President has never laid anyone off, oh wait...

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/19/business/19autos.html

Obama is open about acknowledging his firm complicity with and loyalty to the union thugs. He is on record saying, "I owe these people. When they call, I answer the phone"--because they are much of the reason he got elected. Meanwhile, non-union workers are treated as enemies; just ask the thousands of people almost denied jobs in South Carolina when Obama's dept. of labor sued to block the new Being manufacturing plant there because it is a right-to-work state.

Wrong. It was NEVER in the bill to begin with. David Englin, Charniele Herring and the rest of the Dems in the VA General Assembly flat-out lied about that.

@Lee - the fact that transvaignal probe was even freaking suggested is enough for any rational woman or man to reject the GOP. I don't care if it in the bill or not. Ranks right up there with 'legitimate rape'. GOP platform even rejects choice in the cases of incest and rape. All pro-life until you're born, then you're on your own.

Transvaginal probe should be used anally on anyone who thinks that's even reasonable. Just to prove you're an a-hole. Of course, you'll have to pay for it yourself, it is mandatory. But need you to understand just how much of an idiot anyone is who thinks that's not an invasive procedure and an invasion on a woman's body.

to Rick B: Just try to remember that you can't argue or reason w/ folks like Lee Hernly or Don Joy. They are not burdened by any facts and refuse to listen to reason. Best to ignore them. The GOP strategy these days seems to be lie; repeat the lie several times; attack the fact-checkers who say it is a lie; attack the media who points out falsehoods; repeat the lie some more and hope folks will believe it; if folks don't believe it, attack them and call them liars. It is really very sad. But best to just let it go.

@ Locally - The whole 'transvaginal' thing started with Planned Parenthood and David Englin propagating the lie. Read the bill. It's NOT in there.

ALL Planned Parenthood facilities and 99% of the other abortion clinics were already performing ultrasounds before this bill was introduced. Where is your outrage there? This bill was designed so that the 1% of clinic doctors, not some GOPer followed the 'standard medical practice in the community' as it says in the bill.

Maybe it would help you to study about the Laffer Curve.

Newsflash - We are Greece because of the move toward Socialism & the welfare state over the last 80 years or so. We are over 100%+ debt to GDP and are climbing fast. Keeping the status quo isn't going to do it anymore. How many more cities and towns need to go broke before something's done?

Austerity is NOT the issue with Greece. Like here in America, where we have twice as many folks working for Govt as the private sector, Greece has an extremely large welfare state. Kudos to the Greek Govt for doing something about it by rounding up the illegal immigrants who've been feeding off their state for years.

Greece, Italy, Portugal, Spain, France - all implemented the republican party's draconian spending cuts without raising revenue. All these countries are back in recession. This is an unrefutable economic fact (economics and finance being something that a majority of the posters are sorely lacking an fundamental understanding).

We will be there if we go back to the past with the republican platform. Again, repeat. Circa 1980, 1984, 1988 and 2000. Spin it anyway you'd like. It's just the past and it doesn't work.

While GM has cut labor costs, they still haven't repaid any of the loans and the taxpayer is on the hook right now for $100 billion in losses which is why Govt can't sell its stake. Ford didn't take bailout money unlike the other two. They did the courageous thing unlike GM who went crying to the Feds.

GM should have gone through a managed bankruptcy.

BTW/ Nice copy & paste job from BO's website. The site couldn't be lying now could it?

http://www.barackobama.com/record/economy

Limited government exists to protect inalienable rights, such as the right to life. And no one has the right to demand that others pay for their birth control supplies or abortions. Sandra Fluke and the likes of her should just STFU.

to Locally Involved: You got that right! :)
Let's hear it for older, white, straight men who can't get pregnant!

@oldtowner - LOL!! Hey, just glad to be an older white woman who can't get prego! I think back to the days of being the old white woman manager in a Fortune 500 company. How much woman have needed to fight for the right to be taken as serious minded - and then overcome being intelligent and in a career and NOT against marriage. When you needed your husband's signature to get a credit card. The right to make my own personal medical decisions is just a continuation of the struggle. Here's to being older and NOT going back to the policies of the past!

@Lee H: sheesh...it's like talking to a brick wall....yes, a vaginal ultrasound is not mentioned in the final bill, because McDonnell gave in and removed that requirement. What don't you understand? And once again, attack the source.

Wrong again OT. The copy I linked you to was the prefiled copy as is this one which is dated 1/10/2012.

http://lis.virginia.gov/cgi-bin/legp604.exe?121+ful+HB462

I dare you to find the 'vaginal requirement'. Wasn't in the original bill or in any of the other versions of the bill.

Fact is, David Englin, Charmiele Herring and the other Virginia Democrats lied through their teeth.

Considering the Democrat Party's long and shameful history of bigotry and racism, let's see if you can walk the walk and talk the talk there Rick.

Jim Moran's called blacks 'hyenas' - I'm ready for debate whenever you are...

@rick - always find it fascinating that the far right has no problem remembering the 2nd amendment, but draws a blank on the 8th commandment: Thou shalt not bear false witness.

The concept found in what has come to be known as the Laffer Curve is also actually found in rather ancient writings of Middle Eastern empires concerning a government role in an economy. Even John Maynard Keynes acknowledged and embraced the concept , as did Hume and Adam Smith and others throughout history. Of course, its application is controversial. But a serious person doesn't scoff at its value and relevance.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laffer_curve#History

Despite what you allege, Art Laffer has not failed to defend his namesake theory, nor has he "said it doesn't work.".

Rick - You will note even the last line of the Huff Post article makes mention of what I referred to.

"According to Moran, Obama was like the "Lion King," while some of the disparaging voices in background were just like "the hyenas" from the play."

In case you don’t remember, the movie 'Lion King' portrays the hyenas as “jive-talking gangstas”. Congressman Moran even went so far as to challenge Congressman West’s black authenticity.

And Rick -

I am exceedingly happy to debate you anytime.

Show me where he says that. He doesn't.

The most important thing is, no matter who wins the Presidency, is for the GOP to take back the Senate and win more of the House because let's face it Romney is a NE Republican and as Liberal as our current Big Govt President when you get right down to it. This way we force either to govern from the right.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=deRo-BXLAz0

Yes.

You didn't.